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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
# Sauter and Kyle Busch Fail Post Race Inspection UPDATE 2 penalties announced: The Chevys of #70-Johnny Sauter and #5-Kyle Busch both did not meet the minimum height requirements during post-race inspection. #83-Brian Vickers failed post-qualifying inspection on Friday and had his time disallowed. NASCAR will take both of the cars back to the R&D Center in Concord, NC to test them further to see if the problem is the result of something that happened on the track or not. If any penalties are assessed, they are likely to be announced on Tuesday.(7-1-2007)

UPDATE 2: NASCAR has issued penalties and fines to the #5 and #70 teams that compete in the Nextel Cup Series, as a result of rule infractions found this past weekend at New Hampshire International Speedway in Loudon, N.H. Both cars – the #5 Chevy driven by Kyle Busch and the #70 Chevy driven by Johnny Sauter – were found to be in violation of Sections 12-4-A (actions detrimental to stock car racing); 12-4-Q (car, car parts, components and/or equipment used do not conform to NASCAR rules); and 20-12.8.1B, COT Technical Bulletin #3, dated 4/10/07 (failed to meet the minimum front car heights) of the 2007 NASCAR rule book. The violations were found during post-race inspection last Sunday. As a result, Kyle Busch and Sauter have each been penalized 25 driver championship points. Their respective crew chiefs – Alan Gustafson and Robert “Bootie” Barker – have each been fined $25,000 and placed on probation until Sept. 19. In addition, Rick Hendrick, owner of the #5, has been penalized 25 car owner championship points as has Joe Custer, the owner of the #70.(NASCAR PR), see updated drivers/owners pts on my Owners/Drivers Points standings page.(7-4-2007)

Let's see here, it's a COT race, fail post-race inspection but only a 25pt fine and probation for the Crew Chief? So apparantely failing post-race inspection is better than failing pre-qual or pre-race inspection. Interesting... :doh:
 

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Before you guys go rushing all over NASCAR's butt, consider the fact of what happened if they did it on purpose and messed with the CoT then yeah there going to get stoned, but if it was something simple like with what Gordon had at Daytona, then yeah it wouldn't be that bad.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
True but I thought NASCAR said they were not going to tolerate ANY infractions with the COT regardless of when they occur? Maybe there was a parts failure in the car but if that was the case why even penalize them at all because that would be something uncontrollable? What it all comes down to is when the 5 and 70 went through post-race inspection they were not the legal height mandated by the rules.

"Both cars were too low in the left front," Poston said. "But we don't consider this tampering with the integrity of the Car of Tomorrow. It's not that kind of an infraction. It's more of what we would call a competition infraction."
So now it's at the descretion of NASCAR on what's on purpose and what's not? Talk about a GREY AREA!
 

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JJ48Fan said:
True but I thought NASCAR said they were not going to tolerate ANY infractions with the COT regardless of when they occur? Maybe there was a parts failure in the car but if that was the case why even penalize them at all because that would be something uncontrollable? What it all comes down to is when the 5 and 70 went through post-race inspection they were not the legal height mandated by the rules.

"Both cars were too low in the left front," Poston said. "But we don't consider this tampering with the integrity of the Car of Tomorrow. It's not that kind of an infraction. It's more of what we would call a competition infraction."
So now it's at the descretion of NASCAR on what's on purpose and what's not? Talk about a GREY AREA!
No they said if they caught you messing with the CoT meaning jerk around with the car like the 8, 24, 48 then you going to get penalized hard.

And yes its up NASCAR's discreation whats on purpose and whats not, who you think was going to make the ruling, God?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
KK3869 said:
JJ48Fan said:
True but I thought NASCAR said they were not going to tolerate ANY infractions with the COT regardless of when they occur? Maybe there was a parts failure in the car but if that was the case why even penalize them at all because that would be something uncontrollable? What it all comes down to is when the 5 and 70 went through post-race inspection they were not the legal height mandated by the rules.

"Both cars were too low in the left front," Poston said. "But we don't consider this tampering with the integrity of the Car of Tomorrow. It's not that kind of an infraction. It's more of what we would call a competition infraction."
So now it's at the descretion of NASCAR on what's on purpose and what's not? Talk about a GREY AREA!
No they said if they caught you messing with the CoT meaning jerk around with the car like the 8, 24, 48 then you going to get penalized hard.

And yes its up NASCAR's discreation whats on purpose and whats not, who you think was going to make the ruling, God?
Well how do we know that these 2 cars weren't trying to gain an advantage? They could have easily adjusted the fender height on a pitstop to gain an advantage. Being that the 5 car is on the same team as the 24 and 48 maybe they learned from Infineon and tried to do the same fender adjustment but did it in a smarter fashion by doing it during the race so they avoided the huge penalties? Obviously this is all speculation but doesn't it seem a bit fishy that the 5 got busted for a front left fender too low which is the same thing that 2 of his teammates did 2 races ago?
 

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JJ48Fan said:
KK3869 said:
JJ48Fan said:
True but I thought NASCAR said they were not going to tolerate ANY infractions with the COT regardless of when they occur? Maybe there was a parts failure in the car but if that was the case why even penalize them at all because that would be something uncontrollable? What it all comes down to is when the 5 and 70 went through post-race inspection they were not the legal height mandated by the rules.

"Both cars were too low in the left front," Poston said. "But we don't consider this tampering with the integrity of the Car of Tomorrow. It's not that kind of an infraction. It's more of what we would call a competition infraction."
So now it's at the descretion of NASCAR on what's on purpose and what's not? Talk about a GREY AREA!
No they said if they caught you messing with the CoT meaning jerk around with the car like the 8, 24, 48 then you going to get penalized hard.

And yes its up NASCAR's discreation whats on purpose and whats not, who you think was going to make the ruling, God?
Well how do we know that these 2 cars weren't trying to gain an advantage? They could have easily adjusted the fender height on a pitstop to gain an advantage. Being that the 5 car is on the same team as the 24 and 48 maybe they learned from Infineon and tried to do the same fender adjustment but did it in a smarter fashion by doing it during the race so they avoided the huge penalties? Obviously this is all speculation but doesn't it seem a bit fishy that the 5 got busted for a front left fender too low which is the same thing that 2 of his teammates did 2 races ago?
So then what about the 70?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
The 70 had the same issue so I think both cars should have recieved the 100pt penalty, crew chief suspension for 6 races and a $100,000 fine. That's what I would do if I was in charge of NASCAR. Have a clear set of rules with corresponding penalties/fines and if a team gets out of line no matter what session it occured in, keep it consistent. In this case NASCAR would not have penalized them if a part broke but that doesn't appear to be the case thus NASCAR should have treated as bending the rules and thus penalize them accordingly. I don't recall seeing any contact made with another car by either the 5 or 70 which could explain why the fender was too low. Teams also know that if they do suffer contact in the race and it knocks a fender or rear-end out of alignment and they don't retire from the race, they have to fix the damage to get the car back into the specifications or face penalties.

Using basic logic, one would assume that an infraction during the actual race would be more severe than one during practice/qualifying. In the case of the 8, 24, and 48, those infractions were discovered in pre-practice inspection, fixed, passed inspection prior to the race, etc...Any team that fails pre/post race inspection should be subject to equal or possibly stiffer penalties because they were trying to gain an advantage where it counts, in the race. The only way to stop cheaters is to have a clear set of penalties/fines that are handed out according to the rule violation.

Let's get hypothetical for a moment. Let's assume the 5 and 70 did adjust the height of the fender during the race on a pitstop. A 25pt penalty is a slap on the wrist for the drivers and teams. What's stopping them from trying it again? Granted the crew chiefs are on probation and would likely face a suspension but will that suspenion be equal to what the 8, 24, 48 all got? No one know's and with NASCAR being inconsistent with their own rules, no one can will ever be able to develop a clearly defined set of rules...
 

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Ithink in a way it is unfair, but who knows what happened during the race to make both of those cars fail!! They obviously passed the pre-race inspection. It's hard to say what happens during a race.
 
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